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Thursday, October 1, 2009

Debate on Supermarket

There's a roiling debate under way over at Boogiedowner about a proposed big-box supermarket at the Kingsbridge Armory.

Boogiedowner is in favor of the idea and tangles with a spokesman for Morton Williams (the supermarket across the street from the armory on Kingsbridge Road, which has been a driving fore in opposing a supermarket at the armory) in the comments section of the post.

Norwood News visited Morton Williams and wrote about the supermarket issue in detail in July, but one question that hasn't gotten much ink is, if the developer beats back the opposition to a market, what kind of market would work at the armory? Many members of Community Board 7 support a supermarket at the armory, and have cited a desire to see a specialty foods market like Whole Foods or Fairway. But it's not certain whether either of those businesses considering opening up shop there. What do supermarket supporters want to see there and what do they think would actually be viable?

Much of the debate on the Boogiedowner centers on the living wage issue, which we also wrote about in July. On its editorial page, Norwood News has supported the push for a living wage requirement at the armory.


  1. To me a largely overlooked issue here is one that only recently got some ink.... and that is the content of the environmental impact statement.

    Upon close examination, those opposed to the armory supermarket - and others, have concluded that the EIS treatment of issues like traffic and the affect on the local economy is, in a word, wanting.

    Needless to say, this would not be the first time that an EIS has been slanted to reflect private interest. As we all know - and said so at the time - in the cases of the filtration plant and yankee stadium these EIS' were blatantly fraudulent documents.

    So until/unless standards are created that these documents (and MOU's) reflect reality and the authors of them are required to adhere to their contents, anyone in a position of responsibility, like city council members will not have a chance to make a truly reasoned decision.

    Conclusion? the debate can go on all anyone wants, but if the EIS is filled with distortions and lies and there is no proper review nor accountability, then the final result will be the result of power and influence, regardless of the true merits of the case.

  2. To answer Jordan's question:

    This supermarket supporter would like to see another option added to the supermarket wasteland of CB7 that stocks healthy, fresh, affordable products.

    If a Whole Foods, or C-Town, or Food-Town, or Fairway, or Trader Joe's, or Stew Leonard's, or even a permanent farmer's market (as N. Napolitano has suggested), or even a Costco or BJs provided the aforementioned troika of criteria, I would be happy.

  3. Whole Foods, aka "whole paycheck" could be considered healthy and fresh, but is far from affordable. While I like the permanent farmers market idea the best, I would be persuaded by a Trader Joe's, since their prices are very reasonable, and they carry a healthy selection of products.

    For the record, I'm also a fan of Morton Williams -- though there is room for improvement, they are one of the best supermarkets in CB7. There are some really bad grocery stores in the area, and the proximity of the MW to the Armory is unfortunate in a number of ways.

    But Jordan also brings up a good point -- some of the stores people are discussing as options may not even be interested in the site.

  4. So are you for or against a supermarket in the Armory, Greg?

  5. Hey Greg,
    Saying Morton Williams is one of the best supermarkets in CB7 does not set a very high bar. Rate Morton Williams against the very best supermarkets in the city, and then my next question is why can't CB7 have the best.

  6. The idea of a living wage is wonderful to implement, if possible. The choice of a supermarket-is now the realtors-(or bloomberg's) with CB7's support of both; a no comment on a living wage and another supermarket. The real questions of Bronx Jobs should be considered in this situation maybe even more than alternative markets.

    Let the extra cost of foods, by lack of choice, go directly to the worker, via a legislative living wage.(In an economists opinion, to assist in eliminating NYC Poverty (at $50,000) a real living wage of $13 can and should be considered

    And pleaseeeeeeeee dont remember the first fight-15 years ago-to BUILD MORE SCHOOLS

  7. leaving aside their own perspective, can any of these bloggers tell me what factors will ultimately carry the day in this debate?

    it is my contention that y'all can talk all y'all want, but it won't mean a hill of beans. the document(s) that are going to be evaluated are filled with distortions and as a result, the reasonable dialogue that is being waged here and elsewhere will not affect the outcome one little bit.

  8. This comment has been removed by the author.

  9. Gary,
    Blogs are meant to be conduits for debate, much like your show. What is the alternative? Are you saying that it is inappropriate to debate Morton Williams' aggressive attempt to shoot down a potential new supermarket? How does your talk amount to "more than a hill of beans?" Where does your contention leave us?
    >Lou Cicalese


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